Gid,

With me, at least, it actually hurts your argument a little, to claim that the opposing faction is behaving badly, without providing a link to your evidence.

With me, at least, it actually hurts your argument a little, to claim that the opposing faction is behaving badly, without providing a link to your evidence.

That is ok, I read it.  It was an orgy of sarcasm.

i don't know who elected you representative of the working class, but i suspect it's the same person who appointed me mirror of all living liberals. all i can say is, don't expect me to take you seriously next time you complain about jesse jackson, al sharpton or any similar self-appointed spokespeople.

when i realized that latour's article wasn't intended to be a parody, i admitted i'd made a mistake and apologized. since you chose not to accept it--and then decided to spread your indignation to other non-related threads--i'm prolly wasting my time, but i'm willing to put forth the effort.

mocking the working poor who try to get by on their own means and not government assistance

if you can stop taking yourself quite so seriously for a second, you might be able to see that what i was mocking was the sanctimonious suggestions offered TO the working poor by those for whom life is so much easier. as i said previously, i hadn't read your original article prior to commenting on latour's thread mostly because i was put off by its title--which btw had no real connection to the contents; donations aren't entitlements--you started out about people giving you stuff and went off from there.

considering you don't know very much about me, you might take a moment here to ask yourself why and how i am familiar with the type of suggestions i was lampooning.

The responses only underscored what I have long claimed: The American left has a deep disdain for the working poor in this country. They would rather that the poor be on government paychecks, and thus, under close government scrutiny, than trying to achieve self sufficiency. In short, no longer is the American left QUOTING Thoreau, they're wiping their ass with him.

if you're basing any conclusion about the american left on my articles or comments, you're doing a grave disservice to yourself, your audience, the american left and me. any assessment you arrive at that involves anyone other than me is going to be seriously flawed for the obvious reason that i represent nobody but myself. here's a clue: it's highly unlikely i'm wiping my ass with anyone, much less thoreau.

Again, it goes to show stereotypes that I learned from my father but refused to project on the American left, apparently in error. My father HATED the working class; a mechanic was less than zero to him, a grocery store manager even less. The only work of value in his opinion was done by the white collar, and the working poor were trash that deserved their lot. The welfare bums were noble victims of society (how flawed is THAT?). I thought my father was an anomaly, thank you, JU libs, for showing he wasn't.

i'd prefer not to involve anyone else--especially one of your parents--but since you opened that door, ill walk thru it. that paragraph says much more about your relationship with your father than it does anything else. no matter how forcefully you deny it, you are projecting him onto me and the 'american left' whoever the hell they are. that may seem fully justifiable to you but i highly doubt he was the voice of the american left anymore than i am. for the record, i don't know your father, i never had anything to do with your father, i was not then nor am i now actively advocating your father's beliefs. i don't appreciate having you dump on me whatever of his baggage you still feel compelled to carry.

if you can stop taking yourself quite so seriously for a second, you might be able to see that what i was mocking was the sanctimonious suggestions offered TO the working poor by those for whom life is so much easier.

They weren't offered by those for whom life is so much easier. They were offered by people such as Little_whip, who has known true poverty, and myself (I am currently raising my family of 7 on about $12,000 a year because I can't find anything better...how does that make me one whose life was so much easier?)

I never claimed myself to be a "spokesman" for the working poor, but I AM a member of the working poor, and as such, my opinion counts. I was DEEPLY offended by your comments and those of other liberals in your self righteous response. I have long claimed that the Democratic party has lost touch with the working class, and have detailed experiences with DNC representatives that underscore this fact, and your comments only underscore the fact.

Frankly, what hit the hardest, kingbee, is that you're a liberal that I generally respect; and your comments were horribly insensitive. The fact that you feel they were justified only deepens the cut.

if you're basing any conclusion about the american left on my articles or comments, you're doing a grave disservice to yourself, your audience, the american left and me

You've read enough of my work to know I used to BE part of the American left. In fact, I was part of a VERY close governor's race in Wisconsin that caused Jim Doyle to be elected. My respect for liberals ended the day that a militant liberal tried to take my child away simply because she disagreed with our core beliefs. The separation has only widened as I've seen the true face of the American liberal from MANY sources since November's election. It ain't pretty, kingbee. I've tried to detail the problems I've seen, and have been consistently and callously dismissed in my appraisals. While they don't represent ALL Libertarian views, they DO represent mine, and not a few others who have responded to my threads, so it would be wise to at least consider them.

They weren't offered by those for whom life is so much easier. They were offered by people such as Little_whip, who has known true poverty, and myself (I am currently raising my family of 7 on about $12,000 a year because I can't find anything better...how does that make me one whose life was so much easier?)

once again...i was not commenting on your article nor your suggestions becasue i hadn't seen it or them at that point. my target was overly simplistic suggestions to which i've been subjected. although i've occasionally hinted at them, but feel no need to describe the causes nor the effects of a catastrophic turn of personal fortune, doesn't mean things have been or are at the moment all sweetness and light for me.

as regards insensitivity, please go back and reread lw's comments in that same thread and tell me what's so fucking sensitive there.

king,

Long story short, I EXPECT insensitivity from LW. For you it's out of character.