The journey from there to here
Published on November 15, 2007 By Gideon MacLeish In Religion

It doesn't seem like that long ago, but it was half a lifetime. I was at one of the lowest points in my life and was overcome with the guilt of all of the mistakes I had made. I surrendered my life to Christ and committed myself to a new life.

Over the years, I've been in a number of different churches, some of them good, some of them bad, but all Bible believing churches. I've married and raised my children true to my Christian faith.

Having been raised in the LDS church, as a new Christian, I was aware of the word "cult", and used it frequently as I was taught, to describe those churches who didn't measure up to the strict interpretation of the Bible to which I was mentored. I wanted to be sure of my salvation so I studied eagerly in that journey.

But the word "cult" never set well with me for most of these churches. See, I knew people in these churches, and in all of them I knew people with a deep and fervent love of God. Sure, there were the nutcases, the caricatures out there, but those existed even in the "Christian" churches. We just did a better job of keeping them hidden.

Over the years, though, I found out the danger of the so called "evangelical" movement: they eat their own. While they profess to believe we are saved by grace, that "grace" means you damn well better believe as they do or your out the door. In other words, it is a very selective grace, and humans (specifically THEM), not God, do the defining.

There is a certain vein of Christianity that has become a religion of hate in the truest sense of the world. They profess to be evangelicals, but they have no burden for the lost. They actually would prefer the lost STAY lost, as they don't want to see these people's faces in heaven.

I was the Christian of all Christians. I studied the Bible, I worked on street ministry teams, heck, I even worked the phones for three Billy Graham Crusades. But because I dare question not the doctrine, but the manner in which it is delivered, I have been branded a heretic.

Those who know me might observe the new avatar (unless you'rte having the same problems I'm having with JU on some computers where it keeps displaying my old one). You might also note the one letter "X" responses I have left on several threads. The X does not denote "the unknown" as one might suspect, or any other affiliation, but rather the censorship that has been brought about as I've been exiled from mainstream Christianity for my "radical" views.

While I remain faithful to Christ, I refuse to remain faithful to the apostate church (note, please, I am not condemning INDIVIDUALS within those churches, but the churches themselves, who are unfaithful to their calling). My commitment was, and is, to Christ and Him crucified, not to a building or the "esteemed elders" who judge a man's worth by his financial standing. I will have nothing to do with the religion of hate that characterizes so many "Christians"; as my allegiance is with Christ.


Comments (Page 2)
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on Nov 15, 2007
, 'My grace is sufficient'. I was gobstopped, but it was a lesson well learned.


except that grace only extends to you and not others. The rest of us better damn well believe as you do, or we're gonna BURN, BABY, BURN!

Go ahead, aeryck. "Shake the dust" as your ham friend exhorts you.
on Nov 15, 2007
I guess because they (knew) were despicable, they knew they needed to be saved.


You're only missing one word and I guess you knew that all along. That's what is called 'conviction', sort of like what happens when you throw as stone into a pack of dogs, the one that yelps loudest is the one that has been hit.

.A.

on Nov 15, 2007
"But if you keep doing the same old shit, then it's not going to help."

So immediate sanctification then? I don't think so. Sanctification is a process, not a moment.
on Nov 15, 2007
So immediate sanctification then? I don't think so. Sanctification is a process, not a moment.


Oy! I'm talking about Christians that were in the church since they were little. The can end up being really shitty people. Not people that saw their evil ways and decided to convert.

~Zoo
on Nov 15, 2007

Go ahead, aeryck. "Shake the dust" as your ham friend exhorts you.


You seem to have your lines well rehearsed.

"For many are called, but few are chosen."
(Matthew 22:14)

...................Then went the Pharisees, and took counsel how they might entangle him in his talk.


.A.
on Nov 15, 2007
You seem to have your lines well rehearsed.


Actually I was referencing a comment by your buddy, and you know it.

And by the way, no matter how much you think otherwise, you're not Jesus (the subject of your last little quote). And, again, I thank God it is not YOU I will have to face in judgement.

So tell me again, aeryck, why the shed blood of Christ applies to you and not to me? Why is it that you hold so strongly to your fervent belief that Christ has rejected me? And why is it that God has blessed me continually in my walk as a Christian if He does not feel I'm one of His own?

Aeryck, you are a liar, plain and simple. I sincerely wish you would simply leave my blog, but since you will not, expect no civility or quarter from me.
on Nov 15, 2007

The can end up being really shitty people.


They can also end up being the salt of the earth, it really depends where the good seed falls.

.A.
on Nov 15, 2007
"Oy! I'm talking about Christians that were in the church since they were little. The can end up being really shitty people. Not people that saw their evil ways and decided to convert."

Could very well be that these people never 'got it' but go to church every Sunday as a habit.
on Nov 15, 2007

I sincerely wish you would simply leave my blog, but since you will not, expect no civility or quarter from me.


Another time.

Love,
.A.
on Nov 15, 2007

Aeryck,

Your response kind of proves a point for me, as regards faith.

You asked for a "truce", and were insincere in your request. Because you were insincere, you were unable to refrain from returning to your old habits and attacking me in rather short order. The analogy can be drawn between a Christian who continues in deliberate, willful sin. Their insincerity shows through when they refuse to even try to be more conformed to the image of Christ.

Thanks for showing through example exactly what I was trying to say.

on Nov 15, 2007

Their insincerity shows through when they refuse to even try to be more conformed to the image of Christ.


Jesus said, '...I will give you rest.'

It seems your version of Christianity is what make you hate it so.

This thread is your mirror, read it well.

Love,
.A.






on Nov 15, 2007
I don't hate TRUE Christianity, Aeryck, just the apostates like yourself that claim it.
on Nov 15, 2007
James gives the perfect definition of religion in James 1:27.


St.James rocks! Notice his perjorative meaning of "world".

True religion is God's means of contact with us. The day-in, day-out practice of true religion becomes a discipline which establishes the great commandment of love between God and man and then through that same great love between man and man.

Happiness is not about man and his relationship to the things of this world. True happiness is attained with, through and in the great love relationship between God and man from which flows love of one's neighbor. We see so often that men waiver between one extreme and another. Some seek only material good, yet Christ has great contempt for the world and what the world seeks. Others appear who claim to apply literally various precepts of the Master taken in isolaton. That is a recipe for failure becasue no man is an island. These extremes must be brought back to the path of reason by replacing the complete doctrine of love. That's where the Christian balance is. Its standpoint is we must be concerned with the world, but is concerned with it for God and His Will.

AERYCK POSTS:
I keep this one foremost in my mind when I meet folks that promote the old works doctrine.....(thanks Paul)

'And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.'

.A.


I'd say what constitutes the practice of true religion, Christianity, is of course, not its purely human works, but only works through the love of God among men. A work or deed which has not as its aim, directly or indirectly, the love of God for His own sake, can have no special appeal to Christians. And if works of this nature tend to encourage men in the belief that there can be happiness without GOd, they become harmful.

Bottom line: the Christian must bring all his strength for good works that, while they relieve the body, magnify God and His love.

In Christ's peace, one and all,

I must get to more fall cleaning and preparing for Turkey Day! Yum, Yum!
on Nov 15, 2007
I just get torn sometimes. If I try to do good, is it my own efforts? If I don't do good, then I'm not doing good, and that can't be from God, right? Is it just an attitude thing?
on Nov 15, 2007

From what I've seen in my short life so far, it's *FAITH* that's important, not the religion.

Religion and Churches are things made by Man.  Man is fallible, corruptable, easily swayed and very ready to twist things if it gives them an advantage.  I can be religious about a lot of things; golf, computers, dungeons & dragons, tree worship etc.  But being religious isn't the same as being faithful.

The people who protest "But I go to Church!" as a way of proving they're better aren't in it for the faith, they're in it to feel superior.  Anyone who would look down on another human being and discard them as "lost" or sit there and act all superior to them because they don't follow a specific belief are not Christians.  At least not in terms of what Christianity is supposed to be at its core.  They are followers of a Church.  Not of a faith.

Christ accepted all.  Prostitutes, money lenders, the worst elements of society were welcome at His table.  He didn't sit there and act morally superior, he didn't force his teachings down their throats.  He helped.  He spoke when people would listen.  He spread the word through actions.  I've always found people are much more open when you wait for them to come to you.  When your actions speak your faith and not your words.

But that's the "hard" way to do it.  Why?  Because it requires that you practice what you preach, and most people preach a much more strict sermon than they could follow-through on themselves.

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