Good Morning, A bow to both KFC and lulapilgram for their comments and research. It is indeed true that the Buddha was a Hindu. Just as it is true that Jesus was a Jew. Yet to suggest that Buddhism (a western convention) is an offshoot of Hinduism as Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism is a serious misunderstanding and comes from seeing with a western frame of reference. In the first place, Jesus thought he was part of Judaism, its savior or messiah. This is not true, of course, and Judaism rejected this claim. Followers of Jesus created their own religion and believed they were working on the completion of the Jewish God's plan for the universe.

The Buddha on the other hand, seperated himself from Hinduism, dropped away his class membership, family membership and, indeed, his membership in the human race. He became an solitary seeker, travelling with a small group of other such seekers. He thoroughly rejected his "birth religion" and found his own way. This Way is now refered to as Buddhism, but I must hasten to add that it is a mistake to think of it as an "ism" at all and if you do, you will never see it clearly. This is because Buddhism is not in a single thing about belief. It is about your own personal, individual discovery of your owm true nature and that true nature's intimate relationship to the universe, God included.

In this sense it does not fit into our western lexicon. It is both religion an philosophy, but in truth, neither. It is a set of practices, the practice of which leads to awakened living and a complete integration with all there is.

Be well.

There is a difference between pantheism and panentheism. Please check here:
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Panentheism

My sense is that Buddhism is more the later, if at all. This would be more true I think forthe Mahayama Zen traditions.

Greetings Sodaiho. Thank you for your comments and input throughout this discussion. No doubt, it's been a good learning curve for all.

I would like to assure you that Christianity is NOT an offshoot of Judaism. Christianity is the perfect fulfillment or completion of Judasim. When Our Lord Jesus Christ died on the Cross, the Old Covenant or Law of Judasim was perfectly completed in the New and everlasting Covenant of His Blood. The beginning of the New Covenant in the Blood of the Savior of the whole world (that would include you) meant the end of the religion of the Old COvenant. At the moment of the Crucification, when the Temple veil was rent from top to bottom, God was making it known that the ceremonies of the ancient law were to be abolished by CHrist and also that heaven should be open to all.





With all due respect, Sodaiho, what you freely assert can be freely denied. You are mixing error in your thinking and thus your conclusions are erroneous. God, in His infinite mercy and love for His creation, humbled Himself and became man in the person of Jesus, the Christ. He entered into the very midst of the Jews that they might know Him. In spite of three years of miracles and signs and His teachings and His telling them that He was God, they rejected Him while others believed. Yet, God, who is faithful, didn't give up on sinful mankind. Jesus willingly died for our transgressions and redeemed all of humanity.

Christianity is not a man-made religion rather it is a revelation from God and not a development of human knowledge from a primitive beginning. God did reveal Himself slowly to the Jewish people, and the Old Testament shows a progressive understanding of Him. And as I have said, Christ brought Revelation to its perfection.


There is no Jewish GOd, Muslim God, Christian God, Buddhist God. There is only one true GOd and He does have a plan for His Creation...that will be measured out at His time and pleasure. All we puny and sinful humans can do with our finite intelligence and understanding is search for GOd and His truth and when we find it--hold on tight. By our humanity, we have each been given an intellect, free will, reason, and an eternal soul. What we do with those in our short journey on earth called life is up to us.

What a very interesting reply Lilipilgram.



We will have do disagree here. Jesus died on the cross like thousands of others in Roman occupied Israel. It was only in the fourth century of the Common Era, I think, that the rabbis decided that Christians weren't idolators. With respect, I am still not convinced. To think that God became a man, and then to have followers worship that man, is a tad too close to idolatry to me. From a Jewish perspective, when the messiah does finally come, the world will be transformed and there will be no doubt whatever in any being's mind that he has arrived.



Well, it seems to me that if Jesus were a man and Paul were a man and the early Church elders were men, then it is, indeed, man-made.



You make very excellent points here. I agree with most of them, although with a bit of a turn. There is only one Infinite. No doudt. We do not really know what God is as, even according to you, we are "puny" and of "finite intelligence and understanding." My belief is that there are infinite paths to the Infinite. No one path is the only path. The Infinite expresses itself to us in every detail of our lives and in very personal, individual, and social ways.

I do not agree that we are "sinful" by nature. I believe and see evidence daily to the contrary. I believe, from my experience, that we are complete and perfect beings as we are. It is our practice to see this and live accordingly.

While I agree we have free will, I also agree that this will is to some extent determined by our history and social context. This is a sort of "soft determinism" and is in keeping with karma. I disagree that we have a soul, external to anything. A separate soul goes against nature and the interdependence of the universe.

May we each find our own awakening and in it, be a light to the universe.

Be well.

My understanding of the teachings of Siddhartha Guatama, the 'original' Buddha, are rudimentary. My experience of it is nil (and it shall remain that way) although one of my most beloved friends was quite taken up with it...to the point that whenever he was troubled irritated or something, he would rub the protruding, fat belly of his little green statue of Buddha!

In India, in the 6th c.BC, the intellectuals upheld pantheism of the Vedanta essays, karma, the reward of heaven and endless rebirths of the wicked. When the intellectual revolt set forth in the Vedanta had resulted in disintergration of thought and life, many of the masters offered a way of salvation. According to tradition, Siddhartha was one of these. He was publicly procalimed the sage and the "Enlightened", Buddha. At 29, he renounced his wife and child to seek deliverance from pain and rebirth. In 5 years of asceticism he reached the stage of emptiness and meditating under the "wisdom Bo tree", at Gaya, attained "Enlightenment" (Buddhahood)by understanding pain and the way to conquer it. Before his death, Buddha formulated his doctrine and rules for orders of monks and nuns.

The oldest writings concerning Buddha were compiled several centuies after his death, and they are full of imaginary elements. According to Buddha's own teachings, he himself has gone through various transmigrations having previously been a beggar, a lion, a bird, an elephant, a king, and various other types. He attained perfection so the legend says, and had a right to enter Nirvana, but he preferred to be born again in order to teach men the road to wisdom and to freedom from the miseries of life.


So, from this it seems fair to say that Buddhism began as a discipline for human deliverance from pain and suffering, but became mixed with various cults and sects that embraced the worship of deities (deva), dragons, snakes, as well as with magic, spells, sorcery, etc.

You say that Buddhism "is a set of practices, the practice of which leads to awakened living and a complete integration with all there is."

Again, Buddhism no nothing of God or of one's duties to God. It is based on a pessimistic view of life and is entirely self-centered. It teaches that man is not essentially different from animals, that he goes through a series of transmigrations ending practically in annihilation. While Christians believe they were created by God, and owe to God obedience and worship, serving Him in humility, and doing all for the love of Him, Buddhists, regard man as a particle in the universe whose whole aim is to escape distress, and be at peace in this world. Even charity to others is based on love of self insofar as enmity disturbs one so much interiorily. Where CHristians are saved by Christ, who is the Way, the Truth and the LIfe, BUddhists believe they need no Savior. Buddha saves no one. He indicates his way and each can attain the end by his own powers. Again, there is but one Christ for all ages. But there must be a series of Buddhas, a new Buddha appearing at the work as the work of each one fails.

And the same to you. Christ's peace be with you and with all.


I think this may be a good place to end the discussion because persuing our differences would be "hijacking" Gideon's blog and I don't want to do that unless he gives us the green light.